Forum

aK Discussion Serie...
 
Notifications
Clear all

aK Discussion Series! - Dr. Chukwunyere Kamalu : Person, Divinity & Nature - Book Discussion

Page 4 / 4
(@obadelekambon)
Most BlackNificent Kmty! Admin

The equal sign will kill our people

Sent from my Uhuru Note using Abibitumi Kasa mobile app

ReplyQuote
Posted : 01/09/2017 4:05 pm
(@kevlew)
BlackStonishing Kmty Admin

Obadele Kambon;247954 wrote: The equal sign will kill our people

Sent from my Uhuru Note using Abibitumi Kasa mobile app

Haha...yes indeed. This was definitely going to be part of the response

______________________________________________

We must act as if we answer to, and only answer to, our Ancestors, our children, and the unborn.

Amilcar Cabral

ReplyQuote
Topic starter Posted : 01/09/2017 4:21 pm
(@ayawale_ewende)
BlackStanding Kmty Registered

Obadele Kambon;247954 wrote: The equal sign will kill our people

Sent from my Uhuru Note using Abibitumi Kasa mobile app

Are you saying that it is wrong to make absolute comparisons? If that is the case, what would be the Afrikan way to understand the different selves? I was trying to use those things as a reference of understanding. I just recently got out of the New Age movement, so that is the only reference of understanding I have to go on.

ReplyQuote
Posted : 01/09/2017 5:10 pm
(@kwasimensah)
BlackStanding Kmty Registered

I do not comment on many topics as I am unlearned. However, as a former "New Ager" I feel more than qualified:
The Afrikan metaphysical concepts are true and even verifiable in no comparison to the Eurasian weak attempts to explain reality. The concept of Man-God are one of the greatest misinterpretations of Afrikan sciences. In regard to the "spirit" the Afrocentric view is that we have multiple layers that exist simultaneously in different realms. None to be confused with the idea of one of those realms to be equated with "the all"... instead we as beings do have divinity, however not until we reach the ancestral realm. As the good Dr. says (Brother Obadele) "the equal sign will kill us".....having those false pretenses such as "have ye not heard that ye are gods" opens the door for us to lose reverence and even a placement for ancestors, deitys and even the Creator as well. Someone else can chime in here @kevlew or @obadele to support or contest, but the Afrikan cosmogony says that our ultimate purpose is to become ancestors vs the Eurasian/New Age idea of absorbing as a spirit entity back into oneness with God. How selfish and base would it be to struggle through incarnations ONLY to go back to God vs Evolving into an Ancestor and being a perpetual guide to your descendants and progeny?

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I337 using Abibitumi Kasa mobile app

ReplyQuote
Posted : 01/09/2017 5:59 pm
(@obadelekambon)
Most BlackNificent Kmty! Admin

Ayawale Ewende;247957 wrote: Are you saying that it is wrong to make absolute comparisons? If that is the case, what would be the Afrikan way to understand the different selves? I was trying to use those things as a reference of understanding. I just recently got out of the New Age movement, so that is the only reference of understanding I have to go on.

There are two quotes that I keep in my signature that speak directly to this issue:

"African champions must break the chain that links African ideas to European ones and listen to the voice of the ancestors without European interpreters."
-Jacob Carruthers, "Mdw Ntr"

Ma ku Mbôngi, ka matômbulawanga za ko.
"The community's political institution does not borrow foreign dialects to discuss its' political matters or to educate its' members"
- Kikongo proverb

Try to read Dr. Kamalu's book Person, Divinity and Nature and specifically the section on the human being as multiple selves.
In the meantime, you can check our class discussions on the subject.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZVYwdKiGW5c (Audio only)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yT7TLrKI3sI (Audio only)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nT6r6gncWJY
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ce9xvdB_phg
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0sHhYDZ9Tcc


ReplyQuote
Posted : 01/09/2017 6:01 pm
(@kevlew)
BlackStonishing Kmty Admin

Ayawale Ewende;247957 wrote: Are you saying that it is wrong to make absolute comparisons? If that is the case, what would be the Afrikan way to understand the different selves? I was trying to use those things as a reference of understanding. I just recently got out of the New Age movement, so that is the only reference of understanding I have to go on.

Basically, it is impossible to try to understand Afrikan Thought or systems through the eurasian worldview by saying "this is means this" or isn't this the same as this. What happens is the Afrikan concepts will be compartmentalized into a small box that is the eurasian worldview and what happens is our concepts become minimized and in some cases even forgotten. For example the term god.. you will see eurasians and others say things like Ra, Ptah, Amun, etc is "God". And by saying this we neglect the linguistic, cultural, cosmological, etc explanations that give the understanding from an Afrikan worldview to the point that as we can see today some even not using the indigenous term to refer to the Supreme Being but rather saying god. This term god is of a eurasian origin etymologically and it comes with the anti-Afrikan baggage that is the eurasian understanding or better yet inability to comprehend the African Thought. We can apply this to any attempt to try and understand Afrikan Thought and/or concepts as they are not separate from each other as with the eurasian worldview. Example you gave is chakra.. consider the deep Afrikan understanding of the multiple selves as described in Kamalu's book and the discussion he gave here. This term chakra:

chak·ra
ˈCHäkrə/Submit
noun
noun: chakra; plural noun: chakras
(in Indian thought) each of the centers of spiritual power in the human body, usually considered to be seven in number.
Origin

from Sanskrit cakra ‘wheel or circle,’ from an Indo-European base meaning ‘turn,’ shared by wheel. * see reference below

As we can see the term itself is of eurasian origin and with that comes the worldview and baggage of their worldview (man is evil, man over woman, woman is to be owned, male concept of deities...etc etc in other words anti-Afrikan)

It may be possible to say that aspects of what they are saying was derived from an Afrikan understanding but at the point where it differs is what should prohibit from saying "equals" or "the same" or "this the same as".

Thing is it is impossible to accept one aspect and not accept the whole. For example we can say for example that Christianity, Islam , or Judaism originated in Afrika. Well then if that is the case the very foundational thought of original sin, women is evil, there is a devil that is as powerful as the Supreme Being, heaven and hell, some being died for your sins, man is inherently evil by nature, when you die that is it...go to heaven or burn in hell for eternity....these have to be accepted if we make this claim of origin. But as we analyze what is Afrikan we see these are non-existent throughout the continent to the extent there is eurasian influence. If we use "God" what we are saying is we agree with all the above. Understand? Language is paramount and the terms we use reflect the

Instead to understand we should draw upon Afrikan understandings and laterally on the continent and not forward (toward eurasians/backwards (only in our individual village).

This is to me is the very critical importance of Dr. Kamalu's book as it provides those references for us to explore from the Afrikan worldview.

I hope this helps....

* Reference: https://www.google.com/search?q=chakra+meaning&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&hl=en-us&client=safari

______________________________________________

We must act as if we answer to, and only answer to, our Ancestors, our children, and the unborn.

Amilcar Cabral

ReplyQuote
Topic starter Posted : 01/09/2017 6:27 pm
(@ayawale_ewende)
BlackStanding Kmty Registered

It's gonna take some time to kill the Becky inside of me brothas, lol! Ok, I get it. There are certain aspects of those New Age beliefs that are similiar to Afrikan philosophy, but it is erroneous to equate one to the other. The sad thing is that I've thought with a Eurocentric mind for so long, it's difficult to grasps some of these Afrikan concepts. One day Becky will be dead, and Ayawale will be free. This is the message I got from my Destiny Self, “You have an Afrikan mind, but you don’t know it yet. Your European mind is keeping you from accessing all that brilliance that is inside of you. Once you kill the European inside you, the Afrikan you will be free.”

Obadele, I will check out the videos you linked. I'm already reading the book. Kevlew, I'm going to check out the link you provided. If I have any more questions, I'll make sure I don't make Eurasian comparisons ; ) Thanks brothas!

ReplyQuote
Posted : 01/09/2017 7:16 pm
(@kevlew)
BlackStonishing Kmty Admin

Ayawale Ewende;247948 wrote: Hey Kevlew! I just finished listening to part 2 yesterday. Great interview! In the book I found the concept of multiple selves very interesting, especially in regards to schizophrenia. I think having this understanding would be very beneficial in Afrikan psychology. I'm trying to understand this concept better myself. Are these "selves" different aspects of the Supreme Being that come together in our bodies to help us to fulfill our destinies? Could they be equated to the chakra system? Also, would the heart self (thinking/feeling part of our selves) be equivalent to the ego, and the ancestral self be equivlalent to our DNA?

Ok let me try to respond and please understand that I too and learning. We grow as we learn.

"I think having this understanding would be very beneficial in Afrikan psychology"

The thing is, which is what Kamalu puts forth is , it is Afrikan "philosophy" so the benefit is inherent from that perspective. This is what the book is laying out as a premise or foundation. What eurasians are calling schizophrenia is there lack of comprehension of what the Afrikan Thought is on the concepts of multiple selves. What winds up happening is they take or usurp our understanding...corrupt with their lack of or inability to grasp with their understand and then give it a term and say hey we are the authority on the self! Then sell it to the world as a universal thought and then classify what is Afrikan as "ethno" this or primitive that....here again if we say our multiple selves is like schizophrenia then we fall into the trap of "the equal sign".

" Are these "selves" different aspects of the Supreme Being that come together in our bodies to help us to fulfill our destinies?"
https://youtu.be/ZVYwdKiGW5c
https://youtu.be/nT6r6gncWJY
https://youtu.be/Ce9xvdB_phg

Kamalu:

Role of Chukwunyere Kamalu, Person, Divinity and Nature, 1998
• In the African worldview, the person is viewed as a cluster of selves
• When these different entities are organised, they form a singular entity known as a
person
• The element that coordinates the others is the spiritual double (in this analysis, the
Sahu)
• When this unity breaks down we no longer have a balanced and centred person
• This all has implications for the understanding and treatment of mental illness!!!
• This raises the possibility of putting spirituality onto a scientific context

Person, Divinity & Nature, Kamalu 2008

"Also, would the heart self (thinking/feeling part of our selves) be equivalent to the ego, and the ancestral self be equivlalent to our DNA?"

I think you get the idea now about "equates" when it comes to trying to understanding terms. The crux of the issue is the linguistic deficiencies that exist in the "english" languages coupled with a worldview that is born out of what Chiek Anta Diop calls the Two Cradle Theory.

I hope this helps....and if I am in error I look to be corrected.

ReplyQuote
Topic starter Posted : 01/09/2017 7:17 pm
(@ayawale_ewende)
BlackStanding Kmty Registered

kevlew;247969 wrote: Ok let me try to respond and please understand that I too and learning. We grow as we learn.

"I think having this understanding would be very beneficial in Afrikan psychology"

The thing is, which is what Kamalu puts forth is , it is Afrikan "philosophy" so the benefit is inherent from that perspective. This is what the book is laying out as a premise or foundation. What eurasians are calling schizophrenia is there lack of comprehension of what the Afrikan Thought is on the concepts of multiple selves. What winds up happening is they take or usurp our understanding...corrupt with their lack of or inability to grasp with their understand and then give it a term and say hey we are the authority on the self! Then sell it to the world as a universal thought and then classify what is Afrikan as "ethno" this or primitive that....here again if we say our multiple selves is like schizophrenia then we fall into the trap of "the equal sign".

" Are these "selves" different aspects of the Supreme Being that come together in our bodies to help us to fulfill our destinies?"
https://youtu.be/ZVYwdKiGW5c
https://youtu.be/nT6r6gncWJY
https://youtu.be/Ce9xvdB_phg

Kamalu:

Role of Chukwunyere Kamalu, Person, Divinity and Nature, 1998
• In the African worldview, the person is viewed as a cluster of selves
• When these different entities are organised, they form a singular entity known as a
person
• The element that coordinates the others is the spiritual double (in this analysis, the
Sahu)
• When this unity breaks down we no longer have a balanced and centred person
• This all has implications for the understanding and treatment of mental illness!!!
• This raises the possibility of putting spirituality onto a scientific context

Person, Divinity & Nature, Kamalu 2008

"Also, would the heart self (thinking/feeling part of our selves) be equivalent to the ego, and the ancestral self be equivlalent to our DNA?"

I think you get the idea now about "equates" when it comes to trying to understanding terms. The crux of the issue is the linguistic deficiencies that exist in the "english" languages coupled with a worldview that is born out of what Chiek Anta Diop calls the Two Cradle Theory.

I hope this helps....and if I am in error I look to be corrected.

Thanks again Kev for your insight and humility. I think you misunderstood me when I was talking about schizophrenia. I wasn't equating schizophrenia with the concept of our multiple selves. What I meant was, people who are Afrikan psychologist (which is what I'm aspiring to become) who have this understanding of our multiple selves can help our brothers and sisters who have been misdiagnosed with this condition. These practitioners can, from an Afrikan perspective, see the problem as an imbalance between the selves that needs to come back into alignment, rather than diagnosing them with schizophrenia and drugging them. Yes, I understand that the difficulty of using a bastard language to explain Afrikan truths. Hence, the importance of learning to speak Afrikan languages. That's on my check list. Thanks again!

ReplyQuote
Posted : 01/09/2017 7:46 pm
(@kevlew)
BlackStonishing Kmty Admin

Ayawale Ewende;247971 wrote: Thanks again Kev for your insight and humility. I think you misunderstood me when I was talking about schizophrenia. I wasn't equating schizophrenia with the concept of our multiple selves. What I meant was, people who are Afrikan psychologist (which is what I'm aspiring to become) who have this understanding of our multiple selves can help our brothers and sisters who have been misdiagnosed with this condition. These practitioners can, from an Afrikan perspective, see the problem as an imbalance between the selves that needs to come back into alignment, rather than diagnosing them with schizophrenia and drugging them. Yes, I understand that the difficulty of using a bastard language to explain Afrikan truths. Hence, the importance of learning to speak Afrikan languages. That's on my check list. Thanks again!

My bad sis. I did misunderstand. Thanks for the correction. I got you.

I am because you are....

______________________________________________

We must act as if we answer to, and only answer to, our Ancestors, our children, and the unborn.

Amilcar Cabral

ReplyQuote
Topic starter Posted : 01/09/2017 7:49 pm
(@farafina_di)
BlackDerful Kmty Registered

I can't believe I missed this talk.

Is it possible to purchase the recordings? And a pdf of the book if Abibitumi.com is willing to offer a copy for sale?

ReplyQuote
Posted : 15/09/2018 10:34 pm
Page 4 / 4
Share:

X
X
X
X